Refund of money

Posted on August 27, 2010 16:27

Refund of money

Late 2009 the Dutch Central Bank (DCB) got in touch with SellaBand to investigate whether or not the 'withdrawal option' at SellaBand was a violation of the law on financial supervision (Wet Financieel Toezicht/ Wft). From day one the DCB stressed that they were never under the impression that SellaBand was willingly violating the law. After a couple of months of investigating and us providing several other options they came to the conclusion that it is a violation of the WFT (article 3.5 of the WFT) and that SellaBand, since SellaBand isn´t and is not going to be a Bank, has to stop the withdrawal option. This means that from September 1st we are not allowed to offer the possibility to withdraw money deposited to SellaBand so also not in the two-week period we've used since the re-launch. It' a pity as we really wanted to give you and all new Believers that option, although not that many Believers have used it in the past. But you can still move Parts from one Music Project to another and use the money on your Part balance to buy products in the SellaBand store, soon not just music from SellaBand artists as we will add more stuff to buy.

Since revenues are going to be treated differently we´ve introduced a separate "Revenue balance" where all your Revenue earnings will be credited to. The money on this revenue balance can either be paid out to your paypal account or used to by Parts. However once invested into parts this money will not be available any more to be paid out.




While I applaud the attempt to explain the changes, I think, given the background, that I still have problems with the non-refund part. There was a different owner during those discussions and the "investigation" by the Dutch financial regulators. That change (and the fact that Sellaband is a German entity whose provisions are governed under German law) should have merited a new "investigation". It would be nice to have the documentation of the correspondence online, to see hoe that decision was reached and whether the current situation would lead to the same opinion. Maybe even to show some transparency.

As a Dutch believer, I have these problems already as a generic consumer, for consumer protection, the "Wet Koop op Afstand" applies. That still would give the consumer a week respite to come back to his/her decision to buy one or more parts.

I don't know about other national consumer rights, but I am very curious how those rights are in Germany.

If there can be no refunding of parts, how do the Dutch financial authorities look at the distribution of the revenues that believers could be entitled to, depending on what the artists have promised in their incentives?

Not being able to get parts refunded, but still (according to these terms of use in the new Believer's agreement) getting your entitled revenue share, seems a bit strange to me.

Because of this, new artists here should blow me away (preferably in a positive way) before I start thinking of believing in them through SAB... On the bright side, my groceries budget will probably improve....


der Pieps

quite some people say that it's a scam :-)



Actually, the thing I would most like to hear at this point is what Sellaband IS, not what it is not. That way, it would be a lot clearer which financial regulations are in fact relevant.

At the moment the only things we can say are
- it is not a bank
- it cannot be a shop if money is passed over with no goods being received in exchange



Yes, Xander! The old SAB HQ always used the refund option to justify the legality of SAB. I remember the case when some artists from Australia were concerned about it, for example...


Xander Mol

Oh, and what about an update on my question of six months ago (still did not receive an answer) why SAB is legal without refunding? As old management always told that the only reason SAB was not a gambling or investment site (which are both heavily regulated) exactly because of the ability to get your money back.


Xander Mol

Funny that apparently SAB is the only fanfunding site in Europe affected by this rule?

Must be the way SAB itself organised it then.

By the way: a MUCH more investor friendly rule would be if you would only pay for parts AFTER an artist makes the target. That way no problem at all with refunding.

(I know, SAB will never do that as interest on invested funds is about the only real source of income still).

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